What Do You Think About the Kensington Sector Plan?

Damian Garde February 10, 2012 at 07:46 pm

The sector plan taught me a valuable lesson about non-scientific polls. Here's hoping this method leads to less anger.

Clifford Adelman February 10, 2012 at 11:47 pm

I have no problem with the Konterra part---let alone dealing with what's across the street from it, provided that (a) Konterra build another wing on Oakland Elementary to handle the increased population and endow it to hire 5 new teachers, and (b) Konterra put a tunnel under Connecticut Ave. to handle the increased cross-traffic.
I do have a problem with the rest of the plan. So help me, if they touch the corner of Connecticut and Knowles to destroy the human face and identifications of the neighborhood (Hardware City, Cleaners, Hong Kong), I will chain myself to the parking lot!

ED February 12, 2012 at 03:27 am

The Town 3 to 1 vote you speak of in this article was overturned on January 30 by the Town Council and Mayor unanimously voting for a 60 foot height on the Konterra property (Resolution No. 05-2012 and Exhibit A). I agree with the 60 foot height they just unanimously voted for. It is the only way to keep "fact" from fiction. Mayor Fosselman's letter to the community (posted on the TOK website) dated October 6, 2011 stated "FACT: The 75' designation is only along the Connecticut Avenue corridor; not throughout the Town."

Ashby Graham February 13, 2012 at 02:17 am

Kensignton students go to Parkwood, not Oakland Terrace. And better buy your chain now as that corner will be changing - let's only hope!

Ashby Graham February 13, 2012 at 02:18 am

Not accurate. The Town Council voted to "explore" a 75 foot structure as noted by Cifford Adelman above. And the County PHED Committee went along with it.

Ashby Graham February 13, 2012 at 02:24 am

An escrow account to fund the flooding mitigation for Silver Creek or a railroad crossing would be valuable amenties for Kensington.

Ashby Graham February 13, 2012 at 02:28 am

It's quite clear many of those opposed to the Sector Plan have never read the Plan. Quotes of false stats or scare tactics are evidence. The tallest building proposed is only 75', not 90'. Traffic increases at 50%, BUT that's over a 20 year period and stats take in Silver Spring, White Flint and Wheaton. Kensington makes up 5% of the total in all of communities. The increase is to 10% - 5 to 10, so there's your 50% increase. Simple math the opponents conveniently leave out. The McMansioning in Parkwood and other surrounding areas has had a more significant impact on the overcrowding at Parkwood Elementary than the entire Kensington Sector Plan will ever have on the school system.

Clifford Adelman February 13, 2012 at 02:44 am

Students living on the east side of Connecticut Ave. off Metropolitan or Plyers Mill north of the railroad tracks do NOT go to Parkwood. They go to Oakland, which, of course (in some quarters this is called "common sense"), is within walking distance.

Jobverse27.4 February 13, 2012 at 01:19 pm

The buildings on Connecticut and Knowles are the two biggest eyesores in Kensington. Why would we want more of these monstrosities? Planners told us developers need the 75ft height to make the community center concept successful. Once the community center concept was exposed for its absurdity, planners now tell us it’s a commercial center. And, of course, the 75 ft building height is essential for it’s success.
Does that make sense? Why would anyone would put a business on a hopelessly clogged intersection were the current parking problems will only get worse under the sector plan ? The hard economic fact is that some of our best retail space will get bulldozed to make way for more rental apartments. And, there is no requirement for ground floor commercial retail, anywhere. Huh? We are being taken for chumps. You can start by thanking Nancy Floreen and George Leventhal, They are two County Council/PHED members who cast deciding votes to support the Sector Plan Each received that largest campaign contributions of all County Council members – by a lot - and received the highest percentage from property owners and developers. They also won their elections by thin margins. Makes you wonder they are representing? As for Konterra , the Town’s cozy relationship with Gould is so stinky it makes me gag

Darin Bartram February 13, 2012 at 01:27 pm

[Citations needed]

Jill Gallagher February 13, 2012 at 05:39 pm

Hardware City is a valuable amenity in Kensington. I'd hate to see it go. The real eyesores -- the multiple gas stations and used car lots -- are what needs to go. However, I am VERY skeptical that those properties will be developed since that will take a lot of money by a very motivated developer. The Safeway Corporation gave up on acquiring the Shell station years ago because of the cost to clean it up..As for schools, the "Mcmansions" are not the reason for overcrowding. People are just living in bigger houses. The Parkwood homes have always had multiple children living in them..The Konterra company should offer some very good public amenities to get what they want. If that property is in "The Town," then the kids living in those apartments (and, yes, there will be kids living in those apartments) will go to Parkwood.

MocoLoco February 13, 2012 at 06:13 pm

Jill, if "Parkwood homes have always had multiple children living in them," how did enrollment at KPES jump from about 470 in 2005 to 683 today? I don't believe the school district has been enlarged, and not a single apartment has been built.

Clifford Adelman February 13, 2012 at 10:35 pm

It's not only Hardware City; it's also the cleaners, Hong Kong, Caboose, Continental, and others that serve as orientation points for a community. Nobody has shown us how these points will be preserved in new forms. What do they propose? To send us all to the big box Home Depots of this world out in Aspen Hill? How convenient! How destructive of small business! To send us to some mega-pizza joint on Rockville Pike? How nice! How to pull the money of commerce and joy of interaction out of Kensington in one fell swoop! Whoever voted for this thing never read Jane Jacobs or Kevin Lynch or any other community planning analyst or observer of built environments. There's a reason their insights are timeless. The mega aspects of this thing stink of greed and disregard (what a euphemism!) of what makes for productive relations between people and places.

Dataslave February 14, 2012 at 08:19 am

I'm Leaving, All of this Big box mart/smart growth bullshit, I'm moving to fredrick where things make sense, GTFO kensington, in your pursuits of pretentiousness, you will drive off families and people who have lived here for generations. what ever happened to the idea "oh we don't want chain stores in kensington" that drove out Roy Rogers and replaced it with that shitty savannah's place? Now we have a new chipotle ,Dunkin doughnuts, and with these shitty plans WHO KNOWS WHAT ELSE! but don't you worry, the same thing that happened to silver spring during its revitalization project will happen to you too, Public transit will be your worst enemy as The trouble making douche bags from DC and PG flock to your new shiny town, and this will get very ghetto very fast. you have been warned.

B. Williamson, Hardware City February 14, 2012 at 06:18 pm

I am glad so many people of the town appreciate Hardware City being here! We are clearly worried as to what the future holds. Kensington does need some improvements but I have my doubts that the development being planned will benefit it's residents in the long run. I truly hope everything turns out for the best, for all of us.

Steven Cohen February 14, 2012 at 07:49 pm

Mr Wiiliamson, thank you. Damian, thank you too
It’s easy to understand the highly charged atmosphere given the money involved and the indelible changes we may be facing to the character of our community and our quality of life. Whether these changes are good or bad, it is hard to understand why residents freely accept planning decisions - such as height and density - or even the need for change - without meaningful analysis. The case in point here - why is 75 ft or 60 ft the right or wrong size for Konterra …or Connecticut Ave? Wouldn’t it be nice to see just a little economic analysis as well as the estimated effect on the tax base and our infrastructure? Call us skeptics but, we just don’t trust politicians and, a Planning Board that espouses insufficient parking, more traffic and behavioral modification as good planning. Everyone wants Kensington to be the best it can be with the right level of development and the right checks and balances so the promise of revitalization can be realized Would it be so unreasonable for folks to take a deep breath, step back for a while and run thru the facts. Lets put aside the promises And please, no answers with "that's what the developers said"! Let’s make sure we are getting what we were sold…..and not getting sold out. I have no doubt that the commercial property owners are getting what they want. If you are looking for more discussion see www.savekensington.com. Steve and Colleen Cohen

MocoLoco February 14, 2012 at 09:40 pm

Here's what the scale-it-back crowd never answers, Steve. You compliment Ms. WIlliamson for her views, but if Hardware City is torn down an replaced with a mixed commercial/retail building, how is she better off if it is replaced at 1.5 FAR or 2.5 FAR, or 3 stories versus 5 stories? (Oh, and please remember that the Burkas have said they have no plans to rebuild--especially having just undertaken a big renovation of that site.) People came back to the Kensington Safeway after it was gone during renovation. Why wouldn't they come back to hardware city after a renovation? And, so what if there are 3, 4, or 5 stories above it? Why should Ms. Williamson favor your views rather than the Planning Board, if either scenario results in a new building there?

dibiassi February 14, 2012 at 10:44 pm

MocoLoco, if you hadn't realized, the ToK did greatly grow. About 8-10 years ago the ToK annexed a huge section of Kensington. I believe it was from about Plyers Mill to Perry and Conneticut Ave. to St. Paul's. Also, the empty nesters began moving out and young families started moving in. Would you like to guess how many new students are at KP due to the increase in the Town's boundaries?

dibiassi February 15, 2012 at 12:24 am

It wouldn't be Kensington without Hardware City! Could you imagine Kensington without Continental Pizza? We need revitalization, but we need preserve the character of Kensington. I didn't move here to be among a mass of high rises. If that were the case, I could have moved to Rockville, Wheaton, Bethesda, etc. One also has to consider supply and demand. It there is more supply, there's less demand. You don't think adding 500-1,100 apartments is going to affect property values in Kensington? I would also love for someone to explain why the Kensington Sector Plan has higher density than Twinbrook, when Twinbrook has a Metro stop! Why is higher density necessary for Kensington, but not for Twinbrook. Our property values are higher. Doesn't this mean Kensington would need less apartments to be profitable?

Clifford Adelman February 15, 2012 at 03:50 am

Mono Loco: (1) people came back to Safeway because the Wheaton Giant couldn't handle all the food traffic from Viers Mill south to the Beltway (and we still shop at Giant anyway); (2) what happens when you put a new Hardware City (if you honestly think they would come back after the 3-5 years it would take to construct some rambling behemoth)? easy! there won't be any place to park, and traffic will be backed up to Rockville Pike, adding baskets to the quality of air for everyone. Wonderful! And in the meantime, you will have wiped out Neat & Klean, Hong Kong, Caboose, Continental and left us with nothing but 7 gas stations and a non-functional mess on the side of Metropolitan opposite the proposed Kontera development and some parcels of fragile and peripheral economic activity. Brilliant!

Steven Cohen February 15, 2012 at 04:35 am

Ms Williamson, my apologies for calling you Mr.
MOCO. You have improperly stereotyped me. My stereotype is “skeptic based on what I’ve seen in Montgomery County” I wouldn’t begin to guess about businesses, locations, rents and whether there would be adequate parking. I understand you have an image of what you would like to see. I think we all need to get beyond the imagery of what might be and figuring out what might really happen in the hands of developers. I’d start by considering two things 1) what the sector plan allows and 2) that developers can be counted on to maximize their profits. For example, the sector plan does not require retail on the ground floor. Retail doesn’t make as much money as apts (so I am told). Based on that, you might not be so happy with the outcome for Hardware City.. If you trust your future to the developers, that’s fine. But I can’t. It’s part of being a stereotypical skeptic. You know we skeptics have to take an oath. As for Burka selling …we all have a price ! Steve

MocoLoco February 15, 2012 at 01:12 pm

STeve--I didn't stereotype you. That's a strawman that you created to gleefully hack at. I asked some questions that you dodged and answered only with innuendo. You really don't trust developers. Fine. But, would you disagree that they are motivated by profits, and profits depend on building something that someone wants to buy or rent? Hardware City is there because people in the area (me included) would rather shop locally than truck up to Aspen Hill to be ignored in a big-box. So, why wouldn't Hardware City keep renting this space even despite growth in the area? None of those stores are there because they are providing a public service. They are there because people shop there and the stores make money from this, which they pass along part of as rent to the land-owners. That's the free market. Why do you not trust the free market to bring us both residences and new businesses to serve us and those new residents?

copywolf February 15, 2012 at 03:14 pm

MocoLoco, an unrestrained free market created Silver Spring and Bethesda and Friendship Heights. If you go back a couple of decades, they were much more like Kensington, They were small town downtowns filled with local merchants. No more. That's why we have to be skeptical and why the "free market" requires some oversight.

Clifford Adelman February 15, 2012 at 03:16 pm

I will put a lot of money on the table that, after 3 years out of business in Kensington and (maybe) maintaining inventory during that period (a good chunk of which is degradable and will have to be thrown away), and staring at the expense of redesigning interiors and storage (if any space is left available for that), Hardware City will not come back. You wouldn't, either. Use your head! This is common business sense!

Steven Cohen February 15, 2012 at 04:34 pm

Moco, I agree with a lot of what you say.
Sadly, Hardware City has been suffering a slow decline. Not too long ago they had three or four stores in the immediate area and now it’s just one. I’d like to think they could survive but, the redevelopment of the block - even if developers provide retail space - will just hasten the inevitable because of high recapitalization, higher rents (?) and the availability of sufficient parking (?). I hope they make it. The Hardware City, or any other neighborhood store, is not really germane to the Sector Plan discussion. That’s part of the deceptive illusion that people fall into. I think what is relevant is what you said about business economics and market forces. Retail, and especially retail that requires parking, is not as profitable for developers as compared to rental housing. In part, because parking is non productive. Case in point … I know some people like to imagine Kensington as the next Bethesda Row. But, what does Bethesda Row have that we don’t have? – street parking and lots of municipal parking. Without parking, Bethesda businesses would not be there. Now, if you’re a business are you going to come to a Town with a parking (and traffic) problem? Probably not Part 1 ...see next post

Steven Cohen February 15, 2012 at 04:35 pm

Part 2
So to follow your own logic, the likely result is that developers will build the most profitable buildings…and, to my point, that’s likely to be rental apartments and maybe not the business we would like to envision. I often wonder if our parking and traffic problems have been Kensington’s greatest impediments to growth. Not density and building height. If so, how ironic (ugh, tragic), if the Sector Plan makes both worse, Of course, you could buy into the Planning Board’s social engineering, behavioral modification, “we-know-what’s-best-for-you” battle plan- - adequate parking is bad and residents need to walk or take a bus to the grocery store. (Not to worry, the Aspen Hill Home Depot has lots of parking) Maybe Jobverse27.4 has a point when he says we are being taken for chumps. Yes I am a skeptic but, I think the County Council and the Planning Board has spent about as much “thinking” time (as opposed to calendar time) on our Sector Plan as you’ve spent thinking about declining fish stocks in the Northern Baltic. If you wonder why I harp on the need for some simple economic analysis and impacts estimates, this is why. I think some simple facts and figures - that even I can understand - will shed light on the difference between the pretty pictures, our imaginings and the developer’s economic realities of how our Town may be transformed. I hope to read some counter discussion. Steve Cohen

B. Williamson, Hardware City February 15, 2012 at 05:47 pm

I'm sorry, I did not intend to stir everone up. I just wanted to thank you all for being concerned for us and our future here. We will do our best to stick around and will have to wait and see what happens.

Dataslave February 16, 2012 at 12:52 am

You better! Hardware city is one of my favorite stores and a huge part of my childhood! You can't leave!

Doctor RosenRosen February 16, 2012 at 06:18 pm

I may be late to the party but I am not understanding this? How is adding apartments improving Kensington? Am I missing something here? Please help me understand. This will be built on a vacant lot but for some reason the builder needs an additional 15 feet to make it viable? I'm sure there is a line of builders willing to take Kontarra's place and build what the community wants, not just 4 people on the TOK board. The building costs are close to the same in Laurel as they are in Kensington, yet for some reason the devloper can't find a way to make the numbers work at 60 feet?
If I was the developer I'm sure I would fight for the extra 15 feet. Why not, it's more revenue. Yet what do the communities of Kensington Heights, Rock Creek Hills, Kensington Estates, Chevy Chase View, Parkwood stand to gain by adding these residents? A bridge over the MARC tracks? A clock? A frisbee golf course? Please help me on this - I'm an easy sell. Make your case. DRR

MrsKensington February 18, 2012 at 04:15 am

We own property in Kensington, but got the bleep out to the countryside and have renters. I worry we may not come back to live in it again after this mess. I was sick of getting my car broken into. The elementary school and poolside bitchery (there are other public schools besides lily-white and snobby "KP" - try Garrett Park, Rock View, and Oakland Terrace, many of those students live in KENSINGTON.) (Parkwood is not in the town of Kensington, either, btw, it's just priced like it!) The property prices and taxes. Rock Creek Park is its saving grace along with the small businesses and some lovely longtime neighbors on my street, otherwise, I'd have gone nuts living there looooong ago.